I had my suspicions, as constantly referring to the pirates as "raggies" stinks as though it were intended for the bottom of the barrel audience, so I wrote to Snopes.com, who at that point had nothing on it. After a couple of days research on their part, It turns out that Sorosdy retired 27 years ago, denies having said anything like it and insists he doesn't even know any Navy Seals. Wouldn't you know it, I soon got another copy which now assures me that it came :
"From a Marine that lives just outside Coronado where the Seals train. He uses the Coronado Officers’ club."Seamlessly we segue from the Admiral to some guy in a bar who heard it from some other guy who heard it from a Navy SEAL.
"Having spoken to some SEAL pals yesterday and asking why this thing dragged out for 4 days, I got the following:I'll spare you the rest because of course it's a lie and probably was constructed in the same basement chamber of horrors where most of the Republican propaganda of the last decade was sewn together like Frankenstein's monster. All reputable sources deny all the claims, of course, but I'm sure the bulk of the recipients will still go on and on about "weakness" and how we need exuberant and gratuitous aggression against all "raggies" just like good old Teddy would do.
1. BHO wouldn't authorize the DEVGRU/NSWC SEAL teams to the scene for 36 hours going against OSC (on scene commander) recommendation."
It never ends and it never fails to find a sympathetic audience. Walking through a hotel lobby this weekend, I glimpsed Fox News on a giant screen, "Obama is increasing the size of the Federal Government" crawled across the bottom. Later, in the car, John McCain told us that there was an element of political revenge involved in prosecuting torturers. It never ends and if firefighters were Democrats, Fox would tell us every day how much private property had been ruined by pouring water on it while extolling the virtues of smaller fire departments, with smaller hoses filled with less water under lower pressure. While we're at it, let's privatize it and give the contract to Halliburton.
Hey, did I tell you about the e-mail I got from Jesus saying he's not coming back until we waterboard everyone at Fox News?
The internet; a great tool for conveying information to the world at large and a terribly fast way to disburse mis-information to the world at large.
ReplyDeleteLike you, as soon as some bit of urgent info hits my email, the first place I go to is Snopes. Usually a little bit of research goes a long way.
Unfortunately there are those who can't be bothered to get the FACTS and are content to follow whatever rabid spew is thrown before them. I like to refer to these as the Morlocks.
They can't handle the facts. Many times have I quoted snopes and factcheck to be told that they're all liberals and making the stuff up.
ReplyDeleteThe screed du jour has Karl Marx saying "opners of capital will stimulate the working class to buy more and more of expensive goods, houses and technology,etc. etc" and this will lead to communism through nationalizing the banks.
How bloody stupid does one have to be to spot that the word "technology" would not have appeared in this context in 1867? Marx never said it or anything like it, but how many people have read the book -- and more importantly how many people will sue cloud formations and goat entrails to "prove" that Obama is a communist ( along with being an islamic extremist and fascist follower of a radical Christian preacher)
Every truth creates an infinite number of lies to counter it. There is no hope in a country that hates education so much.
These are the most frustrating sorts of people to deal with. I'm okay with people disagreeing with me - I even think it's healthy for society to disagree.
ReplyDeleteBut facts and logic need to be the basis for those disagreements.
Of course in the minds of these simpletons everything is black and white, and if you believe something strongly enough then it must be true. I should pity them, but they make my life less fulfilling. Second hand smoke makes my life less fulfilling and I think it's perfectly appropriate that there are taxes on cigarettes. Maybe we need a tax on failure to heed the facts (difficult to implement, but I'd probably still be in favor of it, at least as a symbolic gesture).
Yes, theoretically, it is nice to have disagreements and to have debates based upon facts and logic.
ReplyDeleteTHAT would be Utopia and we are not anywhere near that point right now and are regressing.
What we have is a virtual community that is regimentated, divided, and we believe that reality can be anything we want in our blogs, or our "living rooms" as we love to call them.
Freedom of speech does not and should not be misconstrued to include the ability to forward emails that include information that one has not verified the accuracy of the information and the same holds true for information shared on a blog.
To claim that one is just passing it on, and or sharing, or that there is a difference between private blogs and or emails and public information is absurd.
It all entrenches stupidity and ignorance rather than enlightens.
For one, I am starting to believe that the internet is making us more ignorant, just like 24/7 cable news has made us more justified in our stupidity.
Sometimes more is less and I believe that the internet, along with cable news, is reaching the point where more is less and making experts out of quite a few very ignorant people.
The internet does have an amazing ability to dumb things down and to disburse false information. I tend to believe its potential for betterment is greater than its potential for destruction. Access to information has never been easier. And the amount of information has never been more plentiful. But what people do with that information is really what matters. The greatest problem is the Daily Me. If we only subject ourselves to things we know we agree with, we can't grow.
ReplyDeleteEven if these sorts of emails were based on truth and facts, they aren't sent with the intent of cultivating discussion. They're sent with the intent of reinforcing preconceived notions (Daily Me) by connecting with people who hold similar viewpoints or provoking anger with those who hold differing viewpoints. Not helpful.
This is a fantastic example of how blogs are incredibly powerful when it comes to spreading bullsh#t. I wish the reverse were true as well.
ReplyDeleteFor every real virus, there is also the invented virus, or at least the latest iteration of lies, damn lies, and political spin that goes viral. Here is one from Wendy Wright, who represents a group opposing the nomination of Kathleen Sebelius to run the Department of Health and Human Services:
ReplyDelete“Some people think that declaring a state of emergency about the flu was a political thing to push the Sebelius nomination through,” said Wright. (...) If there’s even a hint that [Department of Homeland Security] is manipulating the health situation to push a political appointee through, well, it almost defies imagination that they’d be willing to that.”
And everyone in the psych ward will be a true believer by morning.
Brian,
ReplyDeleteThe internet in theory can be a purveyor of a wealth of readily available knowledge.
Sadly, man by nature naturally seeks out that which reinforces his already held beliefs rather than deal with information that questions his preconceived notions.
Its like the line about all teachers/college professors having a "liberal bias" actually, that translates into, "the teacher/college professor is stating something that runs counter to what I have been raised to believe and because of that they must be part of the liberal establishment."
That is also where the concept of "MSM" comes from....they mainstream media becomes biased because they force a viewer to question their own beliefs and or present information that runs counter to the beliefs that the viewer holds dear.
Then you have this dump all called "Liberals" which is where you dump everything that you do not agree with, do not understand, or whatever gives you a headache when trying to figure it out...
The potential of the internet resides in the hands of the user and that, along with cable news, has increased the dumbing down of America and increased the polarization of our political beliefs.
It can only continue to divide and isolate us as a nation.
"And everyone in the psych ward will be a true believer by morning."
ReplyDeleteBut it's not just the psych ward, it's a political party.
It's amazing how, in this information age, how few people are willing to check out stories that flatter their opinions or even to accept proof.
TAO, I think you make some good points, but I have to disagree that the internet will necessarily dumb us down more. There will be some dumbing of the population to be sure, but I still think the good outweighs the bad. With each successive leap in technology, there have been those telling us we had no where to go but down. Think of when books were first readily available - that was the rallying cry of many. Now I think anyone would be hard pressed to argue that books haven't improved the world. There could certainly be a tipping point, a technological advancement with so little upside that society really does start down the toilet. But I really don't think the internet is that advancement.
ReplyDeleteAs far as polarization and dividing the nation goes, it is a major concern. But I remain optimistic that the forum for discussion (of all viewpoints) that the internet provides will overpower the isolation so much of the internet creates. As they say, only time will tell.
TAO: "Sadly, man by nature naturally seeks out that which reinforces his already held beliefs rather than deal with information that questions his preconceived notions."
ReplyDeleteIf you truly believe this, then why do some liberals (such as ourselves) visit conservative blogs, and why do some conservative bloggers visit here? And why are some of us so polite to each other?
What divides us? Not the comfort that comes with confirmation of preconceived notions and self-validation thereof, but the fear of facing change when a country and its people are facing a major paradigm shift.
When the old guard dies off, I suspect, folks will merely argue as they always have ... without the kooks and trolls that make our present divisions seem all the more exaggerated.
Remember, Obama has approval ratings in the high 60s; the rabble you hear comes from a minority.
Maybe,"when the old guard dies off..." then things will change and I can see the internet as the great innovator that it should be.
ReplyDeleteRight now Fox News has higher viewership than does CNN and that is not due to liberals interested in seeing what conservatives believe. Those are true believers.
If you view the majority of blogs how many of them are rightwing fanatics who hate and how many of them are true conservatives? How many can you actually debate and how many of them become nothing more than one sentence trolls when they are questioned?
Reality there is only one party right now and has been for quite sometime; lower taxes, smaller government is only a slogan not an actual political party or a platform for the basis of civil society.
I will agree with the concept of a paradigm shift, but right now the shifting is occurring within a vacuum of Obama versus nothing.
Which is pretty much the vacuum that occurred during the Reagan 'revolution' it was supply side economics against a demoralized and unorganized opposition. We cannot wait another 20 years to harvest the results of this paradigm shift like we did the last one.
Yes, I have no problem discerning truth from fiction in regards to various emails that circlate the web and various propaganda that some blogs put out...and I know that most of your readers can do the same, but we are a very small percentage and how many times do any of us venture out and question others on blogs?
How many times do we allow bloggers to sit in their 'internet homes' and spin untruths into beliefs without question?
I admire the way right wing nuts seem to find eachother so easily in the overwhelming vastness of the web and they are so inter related.
Yes, Obama has high ratings right now, but how much is that due to the fact that Americans want something and or someone to believe in, to follow and how much of that is due to a true belief in his policies? How much is actual true support and how much is fickle and could actually be lost to the next pied piper that comes down the pike?
"how much is fickle and could actually be lost to the next pied piper that comes down the pike?"And the fickle public is urged on by a highly professional, extraordinarily well funded and relentless propaganda machine that puts out seditious lies at every level for every mentality. There is nothing so stupid and demented that tens of millions will not believe it and resist all contradictory evidence -- and there are few countries where the ignorant and superstitious have so much power. The internet gives them even more.
ReplyDeleteNo liberal democracy has survived very long and we are already running on empty, in my opinion.
8pus: If you truly believe this, then why do some liberals (such as ourselves) visit conservative blogs, and why do some conservative bloggers visit here? And why are some of us so polite to each other?This is true, though it seems like these people are few and far between.
ReplyDeleteTAO: I will agree with the concept of a paradigm shift, but right now the shifting is occurring within a vacuum of Obama versus nothing.Eventually that nothing will give way to something. The GOP will either remake itself as a party of moderates or it will die off and a new party will emerge. This could take decades, and I would hate to have it take that long, but I don't think we will have to wait to harvest the results of the paradigm shift. The seeds have already been planted and begun to grow.
On Obama's popularity, I agree TAO that much of it is related to people wanting someone to believe in, but I wouldn't say support for Obama is fickle in any way. Most Americans don't pay much attention to all of the specific policy decisions going on (or maybe even any of them), but leadership is about much more than that. What people see in him - honesty and a desire to do good - is real. America's willingness to believe in a better tomorrow - that change will come - is helping make that change a reality. I don't imagine support for Obama will significantly decline. And as long as Obama's straightforward approach is seen as a winning strategy, to speak in purely practical terms, its use will grow - in government and politics and beyond.
TAO: "I admire the way right wing nuts seem to find eachother so easily in the overwhelming vastness of the web and they are so inter related."
ReplyDeleteI am not amazed nor impressed. Many of them are FReepers who are paid to find, organize, and mobilize other extremists. Africanized bees do not manufacture honey and attract very few flies. That Wordsmith fellow is one of them.